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#141 Dman

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:44 PM

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but if that transfer came to them, would they really say no?

Probably not...for most of them. Which is why in my postings over the years I've made my position on the transfer/recruitment issue very clear. I am against any and all transfers unless the said transfers benefit Delphos Jefferson. This is the very same position most fans and coaches have for their very own team. It is hypocritical as hell...but also the reality of the majority position in this "changing society."

But I can be a hypocrite while still saving traditional respect for those teams and programs with the character and courage to utilize traditional means...even if I myself would probably not demonstrate such character. Just because I, or any human being, can/could/would/did fall short of a standard does not mean the standard is no longer worthy of traditional respect.
I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.

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#142 flounder

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:45 PM

Dman.......

I think we are entering a different era in high school sports.....you can't fight it any longer...not saying it is right, but am not naive enough to think that all schools and student athletes will be satisfied living with the home grown product......the high school athlete will continue to transfer to the school where he/she can achieve his/her dreams.......I guess, we should put ourselves in their position........would we do the same???? the homegrown athletes who stay at their schools and achieve success may end up as the minority, but in the final picture, will be looked upon as something special........I am not saying this is the right way to achieve things, just saying it is inevitable.......Parents want....student athletes want it.....and just tell me one school that doesn't want it when they are approached.........it's going to happen!!!!!

#143 HH75

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:56 PM

Maybe we need an LB thread so we can talk about The Lue?

#144 Common Sense

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 09:53 AM

View Postflounder, on 27 March 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

Dman.......

I think we are entering a different era in high school sports.....you can't fight it any longer...not saying it is right, but am not naive enough to think that all schools and student athletes will be satisfied living with the home grown product......the high school athlete will continue to transfer to the school where he/she can achieve his/her dreams.......I guess, we should put ourselves in their position........would we do the same???? the homegrown athletes who stay at their schools and achieve success may end up as the minority, but in the final picture, will be looked upon as something special........I am not saying this is the right way to achieve things, just saying it is inevitable.......Parents want....student athletes want it.....and just tell me one school that doesn't want it when they are approached.........it's going to happen!!!!!
Not necessarily. At the root, I think people like to stay in one community, play ball with the kids they've grown up with, etc. When a kid transfers for athletic reasons, it's typically because of a few things:
- don't get along with the coach/ former coach was treated wrong/
- feels like playing at a bigger school will get them noticed by colleges
- don't get along with other students/ teammates/ classmates

The travel ball/ AAU ball concept has given kids the mindset to transfer, because we always know the "grass is greener on the other side". Kids and parents from various schools get together in the summertime and recruit each other to their schools. You're probably right, there is no way to fight it. Many people "overestimate" the talents of their kids.

#145 veteranlefty

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 01:08 PM

Agree the AAU thing is playing a big part as kids enjoy playing with other good players and when they have the summer success they envision having that same success in high school if they can get together....kids and the families spend a lot of time together if they play an aggressive summer schedule so the bonds can form between kids and among the families. No way to fight it at all with open enrollment and the current trasnfer rules...if a parent is willing to move into a district then the transfer will happen....if a kid decides before he starts 9th grade then he can go to any open enrollment school he wants without moving so then it is even easier. No way to stop it as people always find a way around things even if the rules would be changed.

I also agree with posters who have said hardly any coach's would run away from a kid coming into their program...number 1 they really can't if the parents act under the rules...and number two coach's are competitive people and they want to win and coach the best kids they can too. Schools that are successful in certain sports will be targets for kids with some ability in those sports as success breeds success. Why do you think good wrestlers in NE Ohio go to St Eds and Walsh Jesuit? Same reason inner city Cleveland football kids go to Glenville and Akron hoopsters look at Akron SVSM.

#146 roadtoC-town

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 08:45 PM

how would you stop it Dman?

would you do like the NCAA of 1 year sitting out once they start 9th grade? and have escape clauses like parent gets new job, parents move for medical reasons, not saying 20 clause but very few and for specific reasons

or after 9th grade if you transfer no playing sports?

what about before 9th grade?
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#147 slingblade

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 09:24 PM

One had mentioned Zach going to McComb....wow, if thats the case he should just stay in Vanlue. If he is going to transfer to another school he needs to ask himself would it be for a deep tournament run or to really help him get ready for college play.

Who can name the transfers or (so called move ins) from the past 15 years? I actually can't think of any true move ins as of lately. And I mean from one local school to another.

#148 Rocketman

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 06:16 AM

Blade,
The rental housing situation is very good in mccomb..... If I remember right They have a pretty strong junior class...... Even with gas at 4 dollars a gallon I can see this happening..... I'm sure that another school a little closer though Will be putting their package together soon. Where ever he ends up though Has got to be better than the 1 he is in now
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#149 Dman

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 10:33 AM

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Dman.......

I think we are entering a different era in high school sports.....you can't fight it any longer...not saying it is right, but am not naive enough to think that all schools and student athletes will be satisfied living with the home grown product......the high school athlete will continue to transfer to the school where he/she can achieve his/her dreams.......I guess, we should put ourselves in their position........would we do the same???? the homegrown athletes who stay at their schools and achieve success may end up as the minority, but in the final picture, will be looked upon as something special........I am not saying this is the right way to achieve things, just saying it is inevitable.......Parents want....student athletes want it.....and just tell me one school that doesn't want it when they are approached.........it's going to happen!!!!!

I don't disagree with any of this flounder...except...

There are some schools and coaches out there who have refused transfers to my knowledge (see Kortokrax). It does not change your argument in the least. But it is not fair to suggest "everybody does it" or "everybody would do it." We should at least acknowledge that some coaches and schools either would not do it on principal, or out of lack of opportunity. Ottawa is successful without doing it. Arlington and Jackson Center were fine this year. Kalida's history speaks for itself. Continental...? Every basketball team except Ada and LCC did it in the NWC this year. These are just the local examples off the top of my head.

The point is that you do a disservice to those school's mentioned above when you lazily opine "they all do it." The schools that don't use transfers do not deserve to be lumped in with those that do. There is a different level of respect rightfully reserved for those who navigate a more difficult path. This is true in all aspects of life, not just basketball. Whether they navigate this path by choice or no alternative opportunity does not change the fact that the path is more difficult.

My commentary on this subject addresses the humor that manifests itself from fans of teams that take the easier path. They somehow believe that their accomplishments deserve equal respect to competitors who have braved a more difficult challenge. That attitude is so wrong it is laughable. You can ride a helicopter to the top of Mount Everest. Or you can hike it. There are many scenarios in which the failed hikers attempt is much more admirable than the successful helicopter trip to the top.

Hiland and their transfer are an excellent basketball team. By all accounts it is a fine community and the transfer is a wonderful person. There is all sorts of respect to be found in that community's/transfer's successes. They just don't reach the level of what Arlington and Jackson Center demonstrated. Jackson Center and Arlington hiked Everest on their own. Hiland used a Sherpa. There is nothing inherently illegal, wrong, immoral with hiring and/or utilizing a Sherpa to climb a mountain...even if the Sherpa volunteers to help for free. But once you decide to accept the Sherpa's assistance, you forfeit the right to pretend that your accomplishment equals those who hike it solo.

Times have indeed changed. I accept it without liking it. Many teams WILL take every Sherpa that comes their way. Part of these changing times is that the respect given to basketball champions is of less magnitude than it used to be. The funny part is that those who accept "changing times" as reasonable explanation for utilizing Sherpa's are stuck way in the past with their perceptions of what their accomplishments mean in the modern era. You either accept that "times have changed" or you don't.

One hilarious consistency in all of these related posts concerning transfers is that regardless of school (Ada, Hiland, LCC, Elida, etc) their fan reaction is EXACTLY the same. They want to endorse "changing times" as explanation for the Sherpa(s) on their roster while simultaneously ignoring "changing times" as the reason most casual fans don't care about their accomplishments anymore...at least with the respect/magnitude the casual fan used to.

Just as you can't fight the trend toward temporary help...there is no fighting the trend toward fan apathy. I direct you to the declining attendance at high school basketball across the board. Check out the next AAU tournament and see how many people care about the victor besides immediate family. And why should anybody else care? There is no emotional attachments to hired Sherpas...

P.S. C-town...I can't stop it nor do I suggest we could. I just suggest that casual basketball fans simply don't care as much as they used to, and will care less in the future. This has already happened. Times HAVE changed. The only thing we can do is root like hell for those who do it the traditional way...and consistently point out Sherpa's on every roster where they exist. Assisted successes do not deserve equal celebrations. Deep down we all know this. Why do you think fans of "assisted" teams always attack the messenger and make every effort to stop any discussion of their Sherpa's? They want an equal celebration. They just don't want to take the more difficult path required to get the large celebration. There is something pathetic about these changing times...though I do reluctantly accept it.

Edited by Dman, 29 March 2012 - 10:45 AM.

I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.

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#150 flounder

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 11:19 AM

Dman......

I don't like it either, but I really think it is only going to get worse...the schools you mentioned that refused to take in the transfer, may not really be that desireable to transfer into.....OG, I can say is favorable......but Kalida and Korto is a definite no.....there again, only my opinion....of the NWC schools you mentioned....LCC and Ada are probably tops on the list because of their success in athletics.....don't get me wrong.....I am not downgrading any schools, but athletes view schools in different ways......if I have outstanding skills in a certain sport.....say basketball in this case.....I don't give a crap if Kalida has Korto who just keeps hanging on.....I will go to LCC, Ada, OG, or some program who has a young ambitious coach with a team that can make a tournament run....a place where I can have fun and still win!!!!!

#151 Putnam County Lady

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 11:57 AM

Ah you might want to check your facts about Kalida. They did have a transfer move in and play years ago!!!
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#152 Common Sense

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 01:28 PM

View PostDman, on 29 March 2012 - 10:33 AM, said:

I don't disagree with any of this flounder...except... There are some schools and coaches out there who have refused transfers to my knowledge (see Kortokrax). It does not change your argument in the least. But it is not fair to suggest "everybody does it" or "everybody would do it." We should at least acknowledge that some coaches and schools either would not do it on principal, or out of lack of opportunity. Ottawa is successful without doing it. Arlington and Jackson Center were fine this year. Kalida's history speaks for itself. Continental...? Every basketball team except Ada and LCC did it in the NWC this year. These are just the local examples off the top of my head. The point is that you do a disservice to those school's mentioned above when you lazily opine "they all do it." The schools that don't use transfers do not deserve to be lumped in with those that do. There is a different level of respect rightfully reserved for those who navigate a more difficult path. This is true in all aspects of life, not just basketball. Whether they navigate this path by choice or no alternative opportunity does not change the fact that the path is more difficult. My commentary on this subject addresses the humor that manifests itself from fans of teams that take the easier path. They somehow believe that their accomplishments deserve equal respect to competitors who have braved a more difficult challenge. That attitude is so wrong it is laughable. You can ride a helicopter to the top of Mount Everest. Or you can hike it. There are many scenarios in which the failed hikers attempt is much more admirable than the successful helicopter trip to the top. Hiland and their transfer are an excellent basketball team. By all accounts it is a fine community and the transfer is a wonderful person. There is all sorts of respect to be found in that community's/transfer's successes. They just don't reach the level of what Arlington and Jackson Center demonstrated. Jackson Center and Arlington hiked Everest on their own. Hiland used a Sherpa. There is nothing inherently illegal, wrong, immoral with hiring and/or utilizing a Sherpa to climb a mountain...even if the Sherpa volunteers to help for free. But once you decide to accept the Sherpa's assistance, you forfeit the right to pretend that your accomplishment equals those who hike it solo. Times have indeed changed. I accept it without liking it. Many teams WILL take every Sherpa that comes their way. Part of these changing times is that the respect given to basketball champions is of less magnitude than it used to be. The funny part is that those who accept "changing times" as reasonable explanation for utilizing Sherpa's are stuck way in the past with their perceptions of what their accomplishments mean in the modern era. You either accept that "times have changed" or you don't. One hilarious consistency in all of these related posts concerning transfers is that regardless of school (Ada, Hiland, LCC, Elida, etc) their fan reaction is EXACTLY the same. They want to endorse "changing times" as explanation for the Sherpa(s) on their roster while simultaneously ignoring "changing times" as the reason most casual fans don't care about their accomplishments anymore...at least with the respect/magnitude the casual fan used to. Just as you can't fight the trend toward temporary help...there is no fighting the trend toward fan apathy. I direct you to the declining attendance at high school basketball across the board. Check out the next AAU tournament and see how many people care about the victor besides immediate family. And why should anybody else care? There is no emotional attachments to hired Sherpas... P.S. C-town...I can't stop it nor do I suggest we could. I just suggest that casual basketball fans simply don't care as much as they used to, and will care less in the future. This has already happened. Times HAVE changed. The only thing we can do is root like hell for those who do it the traditional way...and consistently point out Sherpa's on every roster where they exist. Assisted successes do not deserve equal celebrations. Deep down we all know this. Why do you think fans of "assisted" teams always attack the messenger and make every effort to stop any discussion of their Sherpa's? They want an equal celebration. They just don't want to take the more difficult path required to get the large celebration. There is something pathetic about these changing times...though I do reluctantly accept it.
Very well said. At it's core, any high school student can go to any school they wish as long as they follow the current rules.
- live in the district
- if a district accepts open enrollment, then you can open enroll
- if a private school, then you are accepted in whatever enrollment procedure the school has.

Everything else is just conjecture.
I guess what it really comes down to, is winning a state championship the end all, be all of high school sports? I say absolutely not. We try to teach our kids to maximize your opportunities, play to the best of your ability. If your team ends the season 10-10, loses the first round of the tournament, but played to their maximum potential, then no one can complain. Sure, some will fall to the old "we didn't work hard enought" or " we need to do this and that better". At the end of the day, you are what you are. Kids a smaller schools play multiple sports, and that's a good thing.

#153 Falcon86

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 02:03 PM

View PostDman, on 29 March 2012 - 10:33 AM, said:

I don't disagree with any of this flounder...except...

There are some schools and coaches out there who have refused transfers to my knowledge (see Kortokrax). It does not change your argument in the least. But it is not fair to suggest "everybody does it" or "everybody would do it." We should at least acknowledge that some coaches and schools either would not do it on principal, or out of lack of opportunity. Ottawa is successful without doing it. Arlington and Jackson Center were fine this year. Kalida's history speaks for itself. Continental...? Every basketball team except Ada and LCC did it in the NWC this year. These are just the local examples off the top of my head.

The point is that you do a disservice to those school's mentioned above when you lazily opine "they all do it." The schools that don't use transfers do not deserve to be lumped in with those that do. There is a different level of respect rightfully reserved for those who navigate a more difficult path. This is true in all aspects of life, not just basketball. Whether they navigate this path by choice or no alternative opportunity does not change the fact that the path is more difficult.

My commentary on this subject addresses the humor that manifests itself from fans of teams that take the easier path. They somehow believe that their accomplishments deserve equal respect to competitors who have braved a more difficult challenge. That attitude is so wrong it is laughable. You can ride a helicopter to the top of Mount Everest. Or you can hike it. There are many scenarios in which the failed hikers attempt is much more admirable than the successful helicopter trip to the top.

Hiland and their transfer are an excellent basketball team. By all accounts it is a fine community and the transfer is a wonderful person. There is all sorts of respect to be found in that community's/transfer's successes. They just don't reach the level of what Arlington and Jackson Center demonstrated. Jackson Center and Arlington hiked Everest on their own. Hiland used a Sherpa. There is nothing inherently illegal, wrong, immoral with hiring and/or utilizing a Sherpa to climb a mountain...even if the Sherpa volunteers to help for free. But once you decide to accept the Sherpa's assistance, you forfeit the right to pretend that your accomplishment equals those who hike it solo.

Times have indeed changed. I accept it without liking it. Many teams WILL take every Sherpa that comes their way. Part of these changing times is that the respect given to basketball champions is of less magnitude than it used to be. The funny part is that those who accept "changing times" as reasonable explanation for utilizing Sherpa's are stuck way in the past with their perceptions of what their accomplishments mean in the modern era. You either accept that "times have changed" or you don't.

One hilarious consistency in all of these related posts concerning transfers is that regardless of school (Ada, Hiland, LCC, Elida, etc) their fan reaction is EXACTLY the same. They want to endorse "changing times" as explanation for the Sherpa(s) on their roster while simultaneously ignoring "changing times" as the reason most casual fans don't care about their accomplishments anymore...at least with the respect/magnitude the casual fan used to.

Just as you can't fight the trend toward temporary help...there is no fighting the trend toward fan apathy. I direct you to the declining attendance at high school basketball across the board. Check out the next AAU tournament and see how many people care about the victor besides immediate family. And why should anybody else care? There is no emotional attachments to hired Sherpas...

P.S. C-town...I can't stop it nor do I suggest we could. I just suggest that casual basketball fans simply don't care as much as they used to, and will care less in the future. This has already happened. Times HAVE changed. The only thing we can do is root like hell for those who do it the traditional way...and consistently point out Sherpa's on every roster where they exist. Assisted successes do not deserve equal celebrations. Deep down we all know this. Why do you think fans of "assisted" teams always attack the messenger and make every effort to stop any discussion of their Sherpa's? They want an equal celebration. They just don't want to take the more difficult path required to get the large celebration. There is something pathetic about these changing times...though I do reluctantly accept it.

What the hell is a Sherpa?

#154 Rocketman

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 02:28 PM

View PostFalcon86, on 29 March 2012 - 02:03 PM, said:

What the hell is a Sherpa?

not paying attention again in class, eh? :rolleyes:

a sherpa guide is one who leads the expedition up the side of the mountain.........
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#155 cubbies4life

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 04:37 PM

View PostRocketman, on 29 March 2012 - 06:16 AM, said:

Blade,
The rental housing situation is very good in mccomb..... If I remember right They have a pretty strong junior class...... Even with gas at 4 dollars a gallon I can see this happening..... I'm sure that another school a little closer though Will be putting their package together soon. Where ever he ends up though Has got to be better than the 1 he is in now

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#156 Dman

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 08:18 PM

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LCC and Ada are probably tops on the list because of their success in athletics.....don't get me wrong.....I am not downgrading any schools, but athletes view schools in different ways...

This may very well be true. But it misses or ignores my larger point. Not EVERYBODY is doing it...yet. We still had 3-4 teams make Columbus who did not utilize transfers this year. We still had 80-90% of the NWC doing it the traditional way this year. Somehow the MINORITY (in our area) has convinced the majority that their "new-school" methods are "correct" or "with the times."

I don't deny that the future trend is in that direction. But the fact is that in the conference I follow (and probably yours too flounder) the utilization of transfer athletes is a MINORITY position. I would also argue that it was not Ada's success that lead to transfers. It was transfers that lead to success. LCC is a different beast, but the same argument could definitely be applied.

I would also opine that it is NOT the kids and their parents who created the current inequities. None of this is possible without willing coaches and school administrations. As argued earlier...there is no rule or law that says a coach has to play a kid. You probably have to accept them educationally...but there is certainly no reason/rule that requires extracurricular participation and playing time is a guarantee. Kids and their parents can be excused for not maintaining a healthy perspective...but what about the adults that were hired to teach our kids?

The point being that if the ADULTS emphasized tradition and competitive balance OVER their selfish desires to take the "easy" path...these "changing times" would have never had a chance to take hold. And lets not mince words here. The 'EASY" path is exactly why we are in this situation. Coaches have quickly realized that building and sustaining successful programs through traditional means is a difficult and fleeting process. It is a lot easier to "accept" transfers, win some games, and deflect criticism from message board man, than it is to win the way Ottawa and Kalida have done it.

It would take a strong coach/person of conviction to turn away a "transfer" based upon principal. However, before these "changing times" we used to respect adults/coaches who had conviction. Now we make excuses for coaches and make statements like "what coach is going to turn away a good player?" That is a liberal cop out to justify a character weakness in the adults who are supposed to teach "character" and "be an example" to our kids.

I'm not making myself out to be a superior person. I'm not coaching. But if I were, I have my doubts about whether I would have the strength of conviction to turn away a player that could help me win games. But my hypothetical character weaknesses, and that of other coaches are not reasons to lessen the standard...is it?

How can we teach our kids that hard work, teamwork, loyalty, etc are virtuous qualities while also accepting "transfer athletes" and playing them in front of kids who have worked hard, stayed loyal, and been a part of the TEAM from elementary on up?

If you break this phenomenon down we can freely observe that in our current society, in many places, there is a MUCH greater emphasis/focus/acceptance on WINNING versus hard work, teamwork, loyalty, etc. I'm more than willing to admit that this cat is out of the bag. But I'm not going to bury my head in the sand and pretend that this trend is "good" or "just." Winning games should NOT take priority over hard work, teamwork, loyalty, etc. It does...but it shouldn't.

Look...it will never happen...but these "athletic" transfers could end over night at the conference level if ALL the coaches got together and made a blanket statement that they would not play "transfers" on their teams. Once kids and parents realized that skirting the "athletic transfer" rules did not lead to the desired consequence, the trend WOULD stop. The problem is that we do not have enough diciplined, fair-minded, conviction-based coaches and administrators who emphasize traditional values over the immediate gratification of winning the "modern" way.

That is a sad statement on the decline of our society. When the educators/coaches are incapable of maintaing a healthy perspective about what values we should be teaching our kids, how can we expect our kids to grow up with a healthy worldview that goes beyond "just win baby?" Steroids, transfers, recruiting, etc are all but differing examples of diverse magnitudes that point to a much larger issue. As a society we have lost a healthy perspective about the decency of right and wrong. We have muddied the waters so much that for many, there is NO right and wrong.

I don't have the answer. I'm like most of you. I'm resigned to the fact that this trend will only worsen. The only difference between me and a lot of you is that I will not sit quietly as the adults/schools around us bastardize competitive fairness and then have the gull to pimp for accolade. They will get their victories. But an asterisk will come with it. Those that puss out and take the quick and easy path will be recognized as coaches and programs who "puss out and take the easy path." They certainly do not deserve to be mentioned with program's of the bygone era who won their titles on a level playing field.
I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.

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#157 flounder

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 08:33 PM

Dman.....

I agree with most of what you say.......but, concerning your last sentence.....do you really think for one minute that the programs who "puss out and take the easy path" will really give a $hit when they are hoisting that championship trophy........the answer is no....and even though most of us will not agree with it, it is what it is, and most people will be accepting it.....and, their program will still be held in high standards.....like I said, I don't agree with it, but then again, I am not naive enough to not realize what is going on in today's high school athletics........in the MAC, we haven't seen it at all, and that is why a state championship means so much, but in your bigger cities and bigger schools, it appears to be a way of life!!!!!

#158 von

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 08:58 PM

View Postflounder, on 29 March 2012 - 08:33 PM, said:

Dman.....

I agree with most of what you say.......but, concerning your last sentence.....do you really think for one minute that the programs who "puss out and take the easy path" will really give a $hit when they are hoisting that championship trophy........the answer is no....and even though most of us will not agree with it, it is what it is, and most people will be accepting it.....and, their program will still be held in high standards.....like I said, I don't agree with it, but then again, I am not naive enough to not realize what is going on in today's high school athletics........in the MAC, we haven't seen it at all, and that is why a state championship means so much, but in your bigger cities and bigger schools, it appears to be a way of life!!!!!
PC Lady, Yes Kalida had a kid move in but he did not change the program.

#159 effingA

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Posted 29 March 2012 - 09:15 PM

I've said it before and I'm saying it again, by the Judge and Jury Dman, only those who were born into the community are allowed to participate in athletics. All others are tainted and thus are transfers! We do not live in Dman's utopia. We can disagree/argue but that's reality. He bad mouths schools/kids/parents/communities who do
not agree with his philosophical beliefs. These schools/parents/kids/communities have done nothing wrong by the standards that are the law of the land and yet they get disparaged by Dman continually. Somehow they're not the same as others because they have transfers. Yet many of these said transfers have worked harder than many in their home schools and because of that, chose to leave. Why should they stay? No one can tell me where I send my kids. If I want to transfer them somewhere - that doesn't make me or the school that accepts them morally corrupt!

#160 Putnam County Lady

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 05:15 AM

Von I believe Kalida made it to the Regionals when the transfer was there.
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