60 replies to this topic

[Bobby]

Rocketman, on 24 March 2019 - 08:51 AM, said:

FYI, the wrestling tournament attendance has steadily increased and this year the finals was close to a sellout..... The problem started 15 to 20 years ago with the proliferation of AAU. The OHSAA was ill prepared for this new phenomenon and now that the cows are out of the barn they have no way of getting those "cattle dogs" to herd them back....... I have no interest and watching a bunch of thugs in D3 and D4 play against the Kalida and coldwater's of the world....The OHSAA allowed that to happen and ye shall reap what you sow....

I agree with Hound Dog that the referees can help fix the game. They won't until they are forced to. It needs to announced before the first scrimmage that the rules are being enforced, ALL of them. Start calling fouls in the first scrimmage. Coaches will scream and holler and players will foul out but they'll figure it out pretty quickly. Please bring back the beautiful game of basketball.

I have a big disagreement with you, Rocketman, calling kids "thugs".

[dufus]

Rocketman, on 24 March 2019 - 08:51 AM, said:

FYI, the wrestling tournament attendance has steadily increased and this year the finals was close to a sellout..... The problem started 15 to 20 years ago with the proliferation of AAU. The OHSAA was ill prepared for this new phenomenon and now that the cows are out of the barn they have no way of getting those “cattle dogs” to herd them back....... I have no interest and watching a bunch of thugs in D3 and D4 play against the Kalida and coldwater’s of the world....The OHSAA allowed that to happen and ye shall reap what you sow....

[dufus]

Rocketman nailed it. The kids aren't the "thugs"! The unethical coaches that recruit and create a win at all cost culture. The School administrators that serve as enablers to these people. Just to win High School basketball games. These are the "thugs". As for the schools he mentioned I agree. Schools that do it the right way. Add 2 more, Archbold and OG. I was at BGSU last year when those two teams played a classic in front of up till that time the largest crowd ever to see a game in that arena! Those are the type of games and teams that I would love to see in CBUS!

[FlightCrew]

My favorite teams/players this wkd were:

Moeller (Pfriem and McBride)
SVSM (Wilson)

South (Adams and Johnson)
Buchtel (Livingston)
Trotwood ( Davis)

Cardinal Stritch (Anderson)

Favorite game: Trotwood over South and Moeller over SVSM
Favorite crowd: Moeller, Trotwood

I think D1 and D2 should be based on enrollment and then toss parochial/privates into either one based on their enrollment. AND if you are public and have 3 or more transplants you are at minimum D2.

D3 and D4 can be public only. Obviously this could cause a problem due to trying to keep an equal number of schools in the 4 divisions.

Have to say, I was very impressed with D1 and D2 this year again. Clearly the best talent. I say just go for it and encourage the better talented teams/schools to play D1 or D2 for competition purposes. There is nothing that can be done to save these D4 schools anymore. Just not level it was in the rural areas even 10 yrs ago.

Edited by FlightCrew, 24 March 2019 - 12:59 PM.

[Bobby]

FlightCrew, on 24 March 2019 - 12:58 PM, said:

D3 and D4 can be public only. Obviously this could cause a problem due to trying to keep an equal number of schools in the 4 divisions.

Lima Temple Christian would be Div II???

[Rocketman]

Bobby, on 24 March 2019 - 03:10 PM, said:

Lima Temple Christian would be Div II???

So would DSJ 😊

[dufus]

No matter what anyone does, or whatever new rules or regulations you come up with there is always going to be unethical coaches that will find ways to do what slimeballs always do. Find ways to circumvent the intention of well meaning people and rules. It isn't just parochial schools ( Deerpark last year). Sad, but I am afraid it is only going to get worse. More schools are going to sell their soul and rationalize that to compete with unethical slimeballs is to find one yourself. Slippery slope. Kinda like what is going on with NCAA basketball. (FBI probe)

Edited by dufus, 24 March 2019 - 03:50 PM.

[Bobby]

Rocketman, on 24 March 2019 - 03:31 PM, said:

So would DSJ ��

Yes, I'm aware of that. Just asking if it would make sense to put a school with 27 boys and no history of tournament success into Div II simply because they're a private school. That would put them in the tournament with Celina 300 boys, Elida 290 boys, Trotwood Madison 361 boys, Shawnee 309 boys, etc... Does that make sense?

[FlightCrew]

Bobby, on 24 March 2019 - 04:00 PM, said:

Yes, I'm aware of that. Just asking if it would make sense to put a school with 27 boys and no history of tournament success into Div II simply because they're a private school. That would put them in the tournament with Celina 300 boys, Elida 290 boys, Trotwood Madison 361 boys, Shawnee 309 boys, etc... Does that make sense?

Think it really matters? They can't even win one of the worst HS basketball conferences in the State as it is.

[dufus]

Yea, but they have a player that scored over 50 points in a game they won by 50. Unethical sportsmanship isn't limited to recruiting!!

[FlightCrew]

dufus, on 24 March 2019 - 04:36 PM, said:

Yea, but they have a player that scored over 50 points in a game they won by 50. Unethical sportsmanship isn't limited to recruiting!!

Who and when was that?!

[Bobby]

FlightCrew, on 24 March 2019 - 04:18 PM, said:

Think it really matters? They can't even win one of the worst HS basketball conferences in the State as it is.

Why even be a member of the OHSAA if your divisional assignment is against schools 10 times your size? They won a close game vs. Fort Jennings in their tournament opener this year. What would justify putting them in a district with Elida, Celina, Shawnee, Defiance, Van Wert, etc...?

[FlightCrew]

Bobby, on 24 March 2019 - 05:04 PM, said:

Why even be a member of the OHSAA if your divisional assignment is against schools 10 times your size? They won a close game vs. Fort Jennings in their tournament opener this year. What would justify putting them in a district with Elida, Celina, Shawnee, Defiance, Van Wert, etc...?

Who cares? World needs ditch diggers too ….
Back to the topic. When is the last time there was a must see team at State? Northland w Sullinger, Burke, Weatherspoon? OJ and Bill Show at NCH? That's what is killing the attendance. No studs anymore in this State.

[dufus]

FlightCrew, on 24 March 2019 - 04:41 PM, said:

Who and when was that?!

Lima Temple versus Vanlue

[Hound Dog]

I think the private schools should be in the same division as the school district in which they reside.

Example.
LCC would be division 2 with Shawnee
DSJ would be division 3 with Jefferson
Temple unfortunately would be D2 with Elida. (learn to recruit better players)

That would really put a different look to the divisions.
Imagine Oregon Cardinal Stritch in D1 instead of D3!
Maumee Valley Country Day in D1 instead of D4.
Africentric in D2 and so on...
For the public schools you would use the Competitive balance numbers for kids that are transfers, etc.

[Rocketman]

All of this competitive balance, multiplier, up/down nonsense is all a fairytale......the OHSAA has this problem in one sport mainly.....AAU is the reason.....the talent level roaming the halls at ie: Lima Sr. is exceptional....BUT, their coach can’t COACH them up, so goes and gets more talent....same at Africentric, Lutheran Hts etc.....AAU factories is what they are, no more no less.....and people are tired of it but the all-knowing OHSAA continues to stick their heads up each other’s arses hoping it will all go away....sad

[Rocketman]

Bobby, on 23 March 2019 - 06:23 PM, said:

You're bizarrely obsessed with attendance and trashing the OHSAA. Why don't you go down to Columbus and talk to Jerry Snodgrass and tell him your ideas on how to pack the Schott. I'm sure he would appreciate your input.

Dear Jerry/OHSAA,
This letter is sent with best wishes but also with a bit of advice. I’ve attended like most, state tournament games since I was a youngster and I know/hope to hell that you’ve noticed the falloff in attendance at your state tournament in boys basketball.....if you haven’t I’m sure your profit-sharing checks have gone down substantially and that you should have noticed. I have a couple suggestions on how to increase your attendance and ultimately your bottom line......#1. if you’re gonna allow all the transfer/living with coaches/AAU teams just be upfront and let them play “club” ball much like girls volleyball is becoming.....these schools don’t really care about their schools or fans, they only care about exposure. Let them play at the Columbus Armory the same weekend and call it the “Flying to the Hoop, Sullinger Play in Classic” and whatever else they call these in season all star games.....”THE OHSAA AAU State Tournament.” Kinda like back in the early days of NASCAR, Run what ya brung. Then allow the rest to play in the state tourney.....also, MOST families can’t afford your outrageous ticket prices. I’m sure you’ll realize after this year’s abysmal figures that someone screwed up royally.....$10 is an acceptable price and would afford a small family to attend....in my humble opinion (which over the years you have clearly not taken as evidenced by all the nasty emails from Timmy I’ve received) this could be a start. I mean, what have you got to lose? Wrestling, swimming, volleyball, track/field, and baseball have either increased or held their own the past 10-15 years. Hopefully you’ll consider these and I look forward to hearing from you in the near future.

Sincerely,
Rocketman

[waterloowonder]

It is certainly a different animal these days. I have been going to the State Tourn. for 50 years. The prices and venue have very little to do with dropping attendance. 50 years ago the arena was filled up with coaches, athletic directors, and school administrators. The general public could not even get in unless you were with a team playing. Today, hardly any school officials attend other than coaches. I am not in favor of moving the tournament back to St. John's Arena. The Schott is just fine, better parking, nicer arena, suites, just all round better. Just like I can't forget when John Cooper coached OSU football, I remember having to deal with rotten scalpers to get into St. John's. I agree, the glorified AAU teams playing mainly in D3 and bringing 75 fans to their games, along with the rough play, have ruined HS basketball. The public schools don't even bring as many fans as they used to. Berlin Hiland had a very disappointing crowd. St. Henry, Crestview, Olentangy Liberty, Sheridan, Columbus South, Trotwood all brought nice crowds. Parents and society in general have de-emphasized HS sports. Lots of parents push their kids into sporting activities at a very young age and the kids become burned out by the time they get to HS, or they quit because daddy can't control their playing time anymore. It is a lot easier to quit that to compete, and parents are promoting that. I don't have an answer how this can be turned around, because there is an ever increasing number of real crazy and mentally ill people out there these days.

[dufus]

Rocketman, on 25 March 2019 - 07:14 AM, said:

Dear Jerry/OHSAA,
This letter is sent with best wishes but also with a bit of advice. I’ve attended like most, state tournament games since I was a youngster and I know/hope to hell that you’ve noticed the falloff in attendance at your state tournament in boys basketball.....if you haven’t I’m sure your profit-sharing checks have gone down substantially and that you should have noticed. I have a couple suggestions on how to increase your attendance and ultimately your bottom line......#1. if you’re gonna allow all the transfer/living with coaches/AAU teams just be upfront and let them play “club” ball much like girls volleyball is becoming.....these schools don’t really care about their schools or fans, they only care about exposure. Let them play at the Columbus Armory the same weekend and call it the “Flying to the Hoop, Sullinger Play in Classic” and whatever else they call these in season all star games.....”THE OHSAA AAU State Tournament.” Kinda like back in the early days of NASCAR, Run what ya brung. Then allow the rest to play in the state tourney.....also, MOST families can’t afford your outrageous ticket prices. I’m sure you’ll realize after this year’s abysmal figures that someone screwed up royally.....$10 is an acceptable price and would afford a small family to attend....in my humble opinion (which over the years you have clearly not taken as evidenced by all the nasty emails from Timmy I’ve received) this could be a start. I mean, what have you got to lose? Wrestling, swimming, volleyball, track/field, and baseball have either increased or held their own the past 10-15 years. Hopefully you’ll consider these and I look forward to hearing from you in the near future.

Sincerely,
Rocketman

Well said!

[Bobby]

Jerry Snodgrass answers tweets sent to him. He also invited a guy who tweeted him to come to Columbus and meet with him.