63 replies to this topic

[Bluetiger76]

Shotgun_Blues, on 05 November 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

And lets be honest there are only two BVC teams that have any credibility in the playoffs,
and it's not Arlington,Van Buren, Leipsic, or Liberty...

Shotgun......Would be interested in what your definition of "credibility" is? Is it based solely on state championships? I would assume you are referring to Hardin Northern and McComb? They did the BVC proud.

Or is it based on "wins and losses" in the playoffs, final four appearances and state final appearances?

Edited by Bluetiger76, 05 November 2015 - 03:37 PM.

[Casual_fan]

I'm failing to see why this is just a BVC issue. There are 26 teams in the region, only 7 are in the BVC.

BlueTiger, I agree, maybe we've diluted the number of divisions too much, but this makes up for Arlington going 10-0 (in '79 I think) and didn't make the playoffs

Good luck to the Devils on Friday. Hope for a good injury free, clean game.

[Bluetiger76]

Casual_fan, on 05 November 2015 - 03:14 PM, said:

BlueTiger, I agree, maybe we've diluted the number of divisions too much, but this makes up for Arlington going 10-0 (in '79 I think) and didn't make the playoffs

Casual.....thats a great point. I am not knocking the 5-5 teams making it....heck, I'm going to the game Friday. Its great for the kids to play another game. I was just referencing how much the field has expanded over the years, with that goes a dip in records of the bottom qualifiers. If you look above I pointed out that its not a BVC issue....there are actually three 4-6 teams that made the playoffs this year (not in the BVC of course).

[Casual_fan]

Blue, we're on the same page and in agreement.

[Irish Viking 87]

3rd & Long, on 05 November 2015 - 10:47 AM, said:

Sorry forgot to include Hopewell..... Regardless the point is that neither of these teams beat anyone that warrants them getting into the playoffs. As far as the "this team played 9 of 10 teams with a .500 or better record", the point is they lost those games. The games that they did win were over teams like North Baltimore (who beat no one) and Pandora (Who beat no one) HL (Injured). Neither team had a signature win this season over anyone. I totally agree that they did what they needed to do to get in and I want to be clear that I'm not knocking either team's accomplishment b/c I want to see as many BVC teams in the playoffs as possible. I just feel like you need to earn the right to get in and not have it handed to you.

3rd- In two different post you alluded to Hopewell having injured players. I'm not sore who you are talking about. If it is their QB, he played against us. He threw for 322 yards, but we took his runs away. We also intercepted him 3 times and stopped him on a game tying 2 point conversion. He's a very good high school QB, but we found a way. Also, if NB or PG had beaten us they would of gotten in and if HL had beaten us they had a chance to get in. We started 2-5 and needed to win out and we did. Because we are hosting a game is not our fault. We finished 4th in the region so that means our kids DESERVE to play at home tomorrow night.

[Bluetiger76]

Irish Viking 87, on 05 November 2015 - 07:23 PM, said:

We finished 4th in the region so that means our kids DESERVE to play at home tomorrow night.

To your point.....There are 22 teams behind Leipsic in region 24. Only one (Hilltop) of those 22 have a better record than Leipsic. Those 22 teams have roughly a 3-7 avg record. Who else in the region deserves a home game other than McComb, Hickville, Lucas and Leipsic? Good question.

[Northwestsports]

I'm not sure but I don't think Hopewells QB played after the McComb game just saying, it dosn't really matter good luck to both teams and one of them is gonna move on

[Bluetiger76]

Northwestsports, on 05 November 2015 - 09:58 PM, said:

I'm not sure but I don't think Hopewells QB played after the McComb game

Tooker did play vs Leipsic. I believe he was 15 for 27 passing with 321 yds and 3 TDs...... and added 57 yards on 13 carries.

[3rd & Long]

Shotgun_Blues, on 05 November 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

Agreed... 6 wins still makes you a very average "B" team BVC Much like the other 6 win BVC team this year...

With all that was wrong with the current state of the BVC don't forget which schools drove it down it's current path,
Pretty sure that wasn't Arlington or Leipsic

And lets be honest there are only two BVC teams that have any credibility in the playoffs,
and it's not Arlington,Van Buren, Leipsic, or Liberty...



And Back to the actual topic before it got hijacked...I totally agree with you Irish Viking 87, I hope to see both teams play a clean injury free game as well. Thanks for letting us come to visit again
Good luck to your Vikings
and
Go Devils!!!

You know I'm just poking the bear Shotgun

Also I'm making no claim for LB getting the short end of the stick at all here. It was pretty clear that this year's team was not anything to write home about and didn't deserve to finish as close as they did to making the playoffs. As far as BVC playoff credibility, I'd say that the 2 teams with recent credibility would be LB and McComb hands down (going off the last 10 years or so).

[3rd & Long]

Irish Viking 87, on 05 November 2015 - 07:23 PM, said:

3rd- In two different post you alluded to Hopewell having injured players. I'm not sore who you are talking about. If it is their QB, he played against us. He threw for 322 yards, but we took his runs away. We also intercepted him 3 times and stopped him on a game tying 2 point conversion. He's a very good high school QB, but we found a way. Also, if NB or PG had beaten us they would of gotten in and if HL had beaten us they had a chance to get in. We started 2-5 and needed to win out and we did. Because we are hosting a game is not our fault. We finished 4th in the region so that means our kids DESERVE to play at home tomorrow night.

All I'm saying is that they're in by default not b/c they deserved it..... 5-5 Doesn't deserve a home game when you only beat Hopewell. It's by no fault of the kids by any means I'm just saying it's like giving a participation trophy. You beat 4 bad teams and 1 average team, here's your home game.

Edited by 3rd & Long, 06 November 2015 - 10:17 AM.

[theWanderer]

Even at 5-5, Leipsic is better than Hilltop and Lucas (and debatable with Hicksville). More than likely Arlington is better than those two teams as well. I would rather the playoffs be filled with better teams regardless of record.

Lucas beat 8 teams with bad records (some of them not varsity programs), and gets a home game. Hicksville beat a high majority awful teams. Your argument is just about record of teams they faced, not the quality of the team itself or the quality of the teams they beat. I think the playoff system is fine because any other way (less divisions), teams like Leipsic would be left out while teams like Lucas who beat up on cupcakes would be in. While this does not work out every year for getting more quality teams in, it does get more deserving teams in on average.

For this specific game, should be interesting. Considering Leipsic did not score offensively last game, if Arlington limits mistakes in ST and offense, they have a great chance to win. Was on the short list of games I was thinking about attending, but I will go south to Minster/Ft Loraime instead.

[3rd & Long]

They should do like Michigan does and a winning record gets you in..... figure out a way to divide things up.

[Bluetiger76]

theWanderer, on 06 November 2015 - 10:44 AM, said:

Even at 5-5, Leipsic is better than Hilltop and Lucas (and debatable with Hicksville). More than likely Arlington is better than those two teams as well. I would rather the playoffs be filled with better teams regardless of record.

Lucas beat 8 teams with bad records (some of them not varsity programs), and gets a home game. Hicksville beat a high majority awful teams. Your argument is just about record of teams they faced, not the quality of the team itself or the quality of the teams they beat. I think the playoff system is fine because any other way (less divisions), teams like Leipsic would be left out while teams like Lucas who beat up on cupcakes would be in. While this does not work out every year for getting more quality teams in, it does get more deserving teams in on average.

For this specific game, should be interesting. Considering Leipsic did not score offensively last game, if Arlington limits mistakes in ST and offense, they have a great chance to win. Was on the short list of games I was thinking about attending, but I will go south to Minster/Ft Loraime instead.

Good post Wander........I wonder if Hopewell-Loudon and say....Liberty-Benton would have gotten in, would we even be having this conversation? Last year a 5-5 Leipsic got in and I didn't hear this much chatter. The system is what it is. Its worked for years, and there are simply more opportunities to get in now. I used the term earlier "the bars been lowered"..........that's partly a product of 7 divisions. When you get to week 12 and/or 13 none of this will matter......the cream will rise.

[3rd & Long]

Bluetiger76, on 06 November 2015 - 11:15 AM, said:

Good post Wander........I wonder if Hopewell-Loudon and say....Liberty-Benton would have gotten in, would we even be having this conversation? Last year a 5-5 Leipsic got in and I didn't hear this much chatter. The system is what it is. Its worked for years, and there are simply more opportunities to get in now. I used the term earlier "the bars been lowered"..........that's partly a product of 7 divisions. When you get to week 12 and/or 13 none of this will matter......the cream will rise.

Had Hopewell or LB got in it wouldn't have been the same b/c neither team would get in at 5-5 and not even 6-4. Both teams would have had to go 7-3 to even have a shot at getting in at an 8 seed and would have had to beat a good opponent to do so (LB would have had to beat (BG, HL, McComb, or VB) and they still may have come short. HL may have needed some help as well with a few more wins. But the fact is that they would have had to have a minimum of 7-3 record to get in, not 5-5. They didn't deserve to get in and they didn't. I agree the field is diluted in D7 and that's why no games even matter until week 13.

Edited by 3rd & Long, 06 November 2015 - 11:30 AM.

[Bluetiger76]

3rd & Long, on 06 November 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Had Hopewell or LB got in it wouldn't have been the same b/c neither team would get in at 5-5 and not even 6-4. Both teams would have had to go 7-3 to even have a shot at getting in at an 8 seed and would have had to beat a good opponent to do so (LB would have had to beat (BG, HL, McComb, or VB) and they still may have come short. HL may have needed some help as well with a few more wins. But the fact is that they would have had to have a minimum of 7-3 record to get in, not 5-5. I agree the field is diluted in D7 and that's why no games even matter until week 13.

I understand how the Harbin system works and realize what it would have took for HL or LB to make it. My point was the fact that more BVC teams got in last year, so very little was mentioned about Leipsic getting in at 5-5. We seem to agree though......when it gets to week 13 it just doesn't matter.

[theWanderer]

If Hopewell had beat Arlington, would they have gotten in?

[3rd & Long]

Bluetiger76, on 06 November 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

I understand how the Harbin system works and realize what it would have took for HL or LB to make it. My point was the fact that more BVC teams got in last year, so very little was mentioned about Leipsic getting in at 5-5. We seem to agree though......when it gets to week 13 it just doesn't matter.

I guess it's just beating a dead horse at this point...... I'm on the bandwagon that the more BVC teams we can get in the better, absolutely. I also believe that just "getting in" does nothing for the league. If you deserve to get in (VB and McComb) I'm all for it. I just see very little point in "just getting in" at 5-5, does nothing for the league.

[theWanderer]

3rd & Long, on 06 November 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I guess it's just beating a dead horse at this point...... I'm on the bandwagon that the more BVC teams we can get in the better, absolutely. I also believe that just "getting in" does nothing for the league. If you deserve to get in (VB and McComb) I'm all for it. I just see very little point in "just getting in" at 5-5, does nothing for the league.

I am a little confused on what getting into the playoffs does for the league that is not happening for these teams "just getting in".

[3rd & Long]

theWanderer, on 06 November 2015 - 11:42 AM, said:

I am a little confused on what getting into the playoffs does for the league that is not happening for these teams "just getting in".

Don't understand what you're asking.....

[3rd & Long]

I'm saying Quality over Quantity..... Had Leipsic or Arlington been competitive this year we wouldn't be having this conversation. Neither team getting in does anything for the reputation of the league of having quality playoff teams that have a chance.