411 replies to this topic

[roadtoC-town]

No dog in fight and haven't read half the post but I think BH wins state without the transfer. Still have 2 good bigs and guards were just as good as anyone in Div 4 at state.

Edited by roadtoC-town, 11 April 2012 - 07:24 PM.

[cubbies4life]

PostPlayer, on 11 April 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

I love Cubbie...

For the record, Arlington will be fine. State semi-finalist team that returns 3 key players (all sophomores); has good size (again), had the best JV team in the BVC, and will be even better out front this upcoming year which typically equals success. Get used to it folks - basketball will be good at Arlington for the foreseeable future with the string of talent coming.

I knew you would respond. Having fun dude.

[cubbies4life]

PostPlayer, on 11 April 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

I love Cubbie...

For the record, Arlington will be fine. State semi-finalist team that returns 3 key players (all sophomores); has good size (again), had the best JV team in the BVC, and will be even better out front this upcoming year which typically equals success. Get used to it folks - basketball will be good at Arlington for the foreseeable future with the string of talent coming.

And next year Arlington visits the evil empire.Darth Vader awaits. I now live in the Fort Wayne area, I will make sure I drive in for that one.

[Dman]

Quote

No dog in fight and haven't read half the post but I think BH wins state without the transfer. Still have 2 good bigs and guards were just as good as anyone in Div 4 at state.

I don't disagree with your assessment C-town. With their coaching, tradition, and available pieces...there was enough to win DIV IV. The problem is they probably would not have made it through Richmond Heights without Bonifat. But I think they would have made it through all the other regionals. There is no doubt in my mind that they were a damn good team with, or without Bonifat. I would like to add that as tough as their team/program is, there was something extra "special" about Bonifat. Along with the Elida duo, I felt he was one of the toughest/clutch players in Columbus. ...and he proved it two years in a row. I do concede that it is possible they COULD have won it without him. I'm actually shocked it took so long for somebody to say this, as I've always felt that was the weakest part of my argument.

Tying this into the "transfer" discussion. I can make a reasoned argument that the "home-grown" Hiland players were robbed of an opportunity to prove themselves. It is not their fault as it is/was out of their control...but there will always be that little bit of wonder about whether they "could have." Before ANYBODY labels this an attack on Hiland I want to repeat... It is not their fault. I don't blame Bonifat for transferring to such a fine program OR Hiland for accepting him. I merely state that it sucks we will never get the opportunity to see IF they could have won 1 or 2 without him. I can make this argument while simultaneously opining that Bonifat was my favorite player on that team. The point being that these changing cultural norms have tainted the outcome for us sentimentalists. We simply have no way of knowing what "might have been."

I wish I could have worded my initial/earlier posts like the preceding paragraph. I really do respect the team, their players, and especially their discipline. My beef is not with Hiland. My beef is with the changing values/norms that are now part of a game that I consider to be the single greatest sport/activity ever created. I accept that this is the new norm. I do so without liking it. I would like to apologize to any Hiland fans...all one of you...I offended with my earlier postings.

As I watched SportsCenter tonight and saw less than 2000 fans in the stadium for the A's game...I was taken aback. While baseball has never been my favorite, we are only a few generations removed from "America's Game." I have to wonder if fans from this bygone era could have ever conceived of a future where less than 2000 fans showed up for a professional ball game opening week? Baseball is dying in all but a few cities.

Could this happen to basketball? I saw a lot of empty seats during March Madness until the very end. I see the attendance trends in Columbus. It seems to me that less and less people CARE about the game. While I'm certain their are all sorts of sociological/societal explanations for these apparent trends that have nothing to do with "transfers"...I can't help but think the phenomenon is either a cause or a symptom of the observation.

Basketball is one of my favorite pastimes. I'm not certain you can find a guy who enjoys watching this game more than me...at ALL levels. That said, it is almost impossible to get me to care about Pickerington Central's championship. It is not that they are not fun to watch, well-coached, etc. There is simply no emotional attachment to watching a group of mercenaries don a foreign jersey. If you can't get a guy like me to care, how can we keep the next generation interested? How many more Kentucky 1 and done championships will it take before only the die-hard Kentucky fan gives a damn?

I sincerely hope I'm wrong. But I sense we might be witnessing the beginning of the decline. If you would have told me 10 years ago that the day was coming where soccer or mixed martial arts would be more popular than basketball in the United States, I'd a thought you a fool. Now I'm not certain that day is not on the horizon. It is just becoming so difficult to care about basketball teams at ANY level. There are still players that offer a glimmer of hope...but is that enough to save the game's popularity?

[slice slice baby]

Dman, on 12 April 2012 - 12:00 AM, said:

I sincerely hope I'm wrong. But I sense we might be witnessing the beginning of the decline. If you would have told me 10 years ago that the day was coming where soccer or mixed martial arts would be more popular than basketball in the United States, I'd a thought you a fool. Now I'm not certain that day is not on the horizon. It is just becoming so difficult to care about basketball teams at ANY level. There are still players that offer a glimmer of hope...but is that enough to save the game's popularity?

i seriously wonder that about ALL HS sports....with the lack of commitment from students due to various other distractions, to parent 'involvement' , coaches having to put in so many hours & dealing with the outside distractions/intrusions=parents & expected immediate & consistant winning, OHSAA & their 'operations/rules' along with continual hiking of ticket prices....HS' costs of operations, etc, etc, etc.....all this equates to overall less fan interest in the end....... the whole long-term (or not so long-term) future of HS sports as we've known it looks pretty doom & gloom to me....

[Rocketman]

slice slice baby, on 12 April 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

i seriously wonder that about ALL HS sports....with the lack of commitment from students due to various other distractions, to parent 'involvement' , coaches having to put in so many hours & dealing with the outside distractions/intrusions=parents & expected immediate & consistant winning, OHSAA & their 'operations/rules' along with continual hiking of ticket prices....HS' costs of operations, etc, etc, etc.....all this equates to overall less fan interest in the end....... the whole long-term (or not so long-term) future of HS sports as we've known it looks pretty doom & gloom to me....

sliced,
that's why we have the 'Corner.....to keep our focus laser sharp on the hs scene....it will be sites such as ours that will help keep the interest high

[slice slice baby]

Rocketman, on 12 April 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

sliced,
that's why we have the 'Corner.....to keep our focus laser sharp on the hs scene....it will be sites such as ours that will help keep the interest high

i sure hope we do/can facilitate.....

[Common Sense]

Dman, on 12 April 2012 - 12:00 AM, said:

I don't disagree with your assessment C-town. With their coaching, tradition, and available pieces...there was enough to win DIV IV. The problem is they probably would not have made it through Richmond Heights without Bonifat. But I think they would have made it through all the other regionals. There is no doubt in my mind that they were a damn good team with, or without Bonifat. I would like to add that as tough as their team/program is, there was something extra "special" about Bonifat. Along with the Elida duo, I felt he was one of the toughest/clutch players in Columbus. ...and he proved it two years in a row. I do concede that it is possible they COULD have won it without him. I'm actually shocked it took so long for somebody to say this, as I've always felt that was the weakest part of my argument.

Tying this into the "transfer" discussion. I can make a reasoned argument that the "home-grown" Hiland players were robbed of an opportunity to prove themselves. It is not their fault as it is/was out of their control...but there will always be that little bit of wonder about whether they "could have." Before ANYBODY labels this an attack on Hiland I want to repeat... It is not their fault. I don't blame Bonifat for transferring to such a fine program OR Hiland for accepting him. I merely state that it sucks we will never get the opportunity to see IF they could have won 1 or 2 without him. I can make this argument while simultaneously opining that Bonifat was my favorite player on that team. The point being that these changing cultural norms have tainted the outcome for us sentimentalists. We simply have no way of knowing what "might have been."

I wish I could have worded my initial/earlier posts like the preceding paragraph. I really do respect the team, their players, and especially their discipline. My beef is not with Hiland. My beef is with the changing values/norms that are now part of a game that I consider to be the single greatest sport/activity ever created. I accept that this is the new norm. I do so without liking it. I would like to apologize to any Hiland fans...all one of you...I offended with my earlier postings.

As I watched SportsCenter tonight and saw less than 2000 fans in the stadium for the A's game...I was taken aback. While baseball has never been my favorite, we are only a few generations removed from "America's Game." I have to wonder if fans from this bygone era could have ever conceived of a future where less than 2000 fans showed up for a professional ball game opening week? Baseball is dying in all but a few cities.

Could this happen to basketball? I saw a lot of empty seats during March Madness until the very end. I see the attendance trends in Columbus. It seems to me that less and less people CARE about the game. While I'm certain their are all sorts of sociological/societal explanations for these apparent trends that have nothing to do with "transfers"...I can't help but think the phenomenon is either a cause or a symptom of the observation.

Basketball is one of my favorite pastimes. I'm not certain you can find a guy who enjoys watching this game more than me...at ALL levels. That said, it is almost impossible to get me to care about Pickerington Central's championship. It is not that they are not fun to watch, well-coached, etc. There is simply no emotional attachment to watching a group of mercenaries don a foreign jersey. If you can't get a guy like me to care, how can we keep the next generation interested? How many more Kentucky 1 and done championships will it take before only the die-hard Kentucky fan gives a damn?

I sincerely hope I'm wrong. But I sense we might be witnessing the beginning of the decline. If you would have told me 10 years ago that the day was coming where soccer or mixed martial arts would be more popular than basketball in the United States, I'd a thought you a fool. Now I'm not certain that day is not on the horizon. It is just becoming so difficult to care about basketball teams at ANY level. There are still players that offer a glimmer of hope...but is that enough to save the game's popularity?

Quite a dissertation Dman, I think it's tough to compare generations in alot of things, and fan interest in sports is probably one. I grew up in the 70's/ 80's where I went from a little kid and the baseball "game of the week", the only one on TV, to cable tv, WGN (Cubs) WTBS (Braves) and ESPN. Sports was dumped on our heads and we ate it up. Now, we have 24 hour a day sports channels, sports talk, dozens of baseball/ basketball/ football games on weekly and no end in sight. The "going to the game" experience is dying. It's not cost effective (ticket, parking, concessions, etc.) you can rack up $200 quickly as a couple going to a baseball game. It's spring time and spring youth sports (a big market) has soccer, baseball or other activities during the week. Plus, and I think this is big the last few years, the game is real-time. You can "stay in touch" with your favortie team and never set foot in the stadium. Real time updates, internet web sites that give you all the information you'd ever want about your favorite team is out there. Actual butts in the seats is a very, very small piece of the revenue stream for these teams anymore.

[flounder]

Dman.....

While baseball may be on the decline in some cities and the crowds look dismal, you must remember it is springtime in the USA.....warmer weather will bring back the attendance...I might also add that in most cities, baseball is still setting record numbers with attendance....

I think that high schools sports is on the downswing.....thank the OHSAA who continue to tinker with their unique system of trying to balance everything out.......omg..it is taking over this freaking country...thanks in main part to our current idiot in the Whitehouse....hell, let's all go on welfare and accept food stamps....nothing better than living like we are in Cuba.....right now, I am so sick of the equality issues going on in this great country that I could vomit.......why shouldn't it apply to sports....

We need to get our backbone back and learn to be accountable for our own actions...something which seems to be a thing of the past....only then will we flourish and return to the good old days........sports is no different......one reason why I am not to upset over the transfer issues......if you want to beat them, get better or be satisfied where you are.....I mean, give everyone a trophy....lmao...create 10 divisions in sports....another lmao.....or better yet, 2 divisions....1 for privates and the other for publics...with 20 divisions in each....give me a break.....maybe I exagerated a little, but I think everyone would be happy then.....well, maybe not those individuals who have a good work ethic and outlook on life won't be happy, but who cares about the minority....

Wow........that felt good!!!!!!!!

[tfloangel]

Dman, on 30 March 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

For example, NOBODY who wants to maintain the most minimal of credibility will argue that Hiland would have won the state championship without their transfer this year.

Nothing I've written above has one ounce of judgement.​ It is nothing but an empirical observation. In other words, I could believe Hiland is the greatest community in the history of mankind...but still have no choice but to acknowledge the truth of how/why they won the state championship. We all have to acknowledge this, or you could choose to put your head in the sand...which is a different debate.

By the way...I've still made no judgement (in this response) as to whether these modern methods are right/wrong. I've just illuminated the truth of status quo.

That said...none of our opinions changes the FACT that Hiland does not win their championship without a transfer.

Dman, on 12 April 2012 - 12:00 AM, said:

I don't disagree with your assessment C-town. With their coaching, tradition, and available pieces...there was enough to win DIV IV. The problem is they probably would not have made it through Richmond Heights without Bonifat. But I think they would have made it through all the other regionals. There is no doubt in my mind that they were a damn good team with, or without Bonifat. I would like to add that as tough as their team/program is, there was something extra "special" about Bonifat. Along with the Elida duo, I felt he was one of the toughest/clutch players in Columbus. ...and he proved it two years in a row. I do concede that it is possible they COULD have won it without him. I'm actually shocked it took so long for somebody to say this, as I've always felt that was the weakest part of my argument.

I wish I could have worded my initial/earlier posts like the preceding paragraph. I really do respect the team, their players, and especially their discipline. My beef is not with Hiland. My beef is with the changing values/norms that are now part of a game that I consider to be the single greatest sport/activity ever created. I accept that this is the new norm. I do so without liking it. I would like to apologize to any Hiland fans...all one of you...I offended with my earlier postings.

Just had to point this out... And Thank you for the apology. And for the record, I did try to point out that they could have won without him, but you needed someone NOT ME in order for you to be able to acknowledge it.

[flounder]

Dman......

I think you have met your match.....be careful!!!!!

[Dman]

tflo:

You quoted me? Not you... If I missed your C-town-esque argument that Hiland WOULD have won it anyhow...I appologize a second time. I think they COULD have...I won't go so far as to say WOULD have. But the point remains that we have been robbed of the opportunity to EVER know.

flounder:

Our politics are the same. I'm going to stay out of that. If high school transfers pisses off so many people...nobody wants to hear my opinions on Obama and liberals.

I dare say that I admire your consistency in wanting to apply political principles to high school athletics. My hunch is that if I get too deep into this debate, I'd find myself on the losing end of this one. I'll probably come off as a pink-panty-wearing lefty. But I'll take a couple swings...for conversation sake.

First...high school sports are not Washington DC. Admittantly weak...but possibly true...no?

Quote

thank the OHSAA who continue to tinker with their unique system of trying to balance everything out

Is the OHSAA tinkering the CAUSE of the decline in interest for high school sports? Or might the tinkering be in RESPONSE? The classic chicken and egg. I think a decent argument can be made that high school sports have started declining moreso due to changing social norms than ANYTHING the OHSAA has done.

Look...I'm not touching the competative balance issue. I think it sucks. But the decline in interest started way before the OHSAA came up with that...

Quote

I am so sick of the equality issues going on in this great country that I could vomit.......why shouldn't it apply to sports....

If we take this to the logical conclusion, then every state championship DSJ's has ever won has been NOTHING but a facade created in the liberal mind. They have competed in the lowest class. It is not as if they are in the Greater Catholic League. I've got no problem with you believing that. But if you want credibility you have to publicly admit that the kids and school you support have benifitted more from artificial liberal limitations than possibly ANY school in the state...at least in the big sports. Are your beliefs in hard core conservative principles so much that you are willing to admit the obvious when it hits so close to home?

If not, then we will have to assume that your position is not based on core principles. Instead, as tflo might say...you are swimming in "gray." It is just a matter of what liberal limitations you endorse, and which liberal limitations you believe cross the line.

I don't mean to put you on the spot. I respect the crap out of DSJ's and admire ALL of their accomplishments. My biggest beef with Jefferson athletics is that we don't strive enough to emulate that success. But I'm not the one simplifying the debate to "if you want to beat them, get better or be satisfied where you are." The counter-argument is that it is real easy to preach those words to others when the team you support has a trophy case full of artificial liberal-created accomplishments. It is not as if St. John's ever "got better" and competed with the big boys. They seem perfectly satisfied to be the big fish in a little pond ala LCC.

For the sake of argument, I am going to assume that you agree there has to be some "artificial liberal" boundaries. For example, I am going to assume that you, or most people believe that classifications based upon school size is appropriate. I am going to assume that nobody believes that Delphos St. John's should compete with Ohio State. In other words, I am going to assume that even the most hard core conservatives among us support some sort of "artificial" limit in attempt to create competative fairness.

Assuming my "assumptions" are correct...what we are all arguing is the "extent" to which artificial/liberal boundaries should be set. There is a lot of "gray" in there. For example, you seem to not admire the NWC teams who voted LCC out. You seem to believe that the NWC should not have an artificial/liberal boundary that limits transfers, geographical locations, etc. I'd argue that such an artificial/liberal boundry is perfectly acceptable and morally/ethically no different than the "class" boundaries that exist and allow Delphos St. John's to consistently win football titles.

Neither of us have the moral/ethical high ground in the debate, unless you are willing to concede that "NO BOUNDARIES" is the best policy across the board. Are you willing to do that? Look...I'd like to think I'm to the right of Genghis Kahn. But I recognize that reasonable boundaries need to exist. I recognize that "reasonable" is a subjective term. As such there will never be consensus.

[Putnammom]

 
 
The wordy definition: The situation of wordiness is one in which writers attempt to utilize several words or extravagant words in the place of a few, well-chosen, concise, and less ambiguous words. This results in unnecessary confusion and annoyance on the part of the reader.

 

[flounder]

tflo.......

Get back here immediately.....I need you!!!!

[Dman]

Quote

annoyance on the part of the reader.

If the concept of reader annoyance was indeed pertinent to she who says so...one might think she herself would eventually grace the readers with one word that is topic related. Logic dictates that reader annoyance is of little concern. In fact annoyance is her vice...

As such, I gladly accept any and all criticisms for being too wordy from such a source. Those whose rebuttals include lazy internet searches and inability to comprehend 8th grade reading level are not the intended target.

P.S. Watching Charlie Brown continuously miss the football never gets old. Any minor annoyances in dialogue length are worth the comedic payoff in the end.

P.P.S. The definition of "wordy" is too long. Plus it includes the word "ambiguous." What does that mean? I hate it when somebody tries to impress us with lengthy posts...when something more concise would do...

Edited by Dman, 12 April 2012 - 02:58 PM.

[Dman]

Quote

tflo.......

Get back here immediately.....I need you!!!!

Damn right you do. Later I'll give you my theory of how liberals trying to skirt election laws (Al Gore), hiding behind changing societal norms as excuses for poor behaviors (tax cheats in the Obama administration), etc parallels those high school basketball programs who utilize transfers to gain an edge. In fact, the more I think about this...I might be able to create a scenario where you flounder share the same political views as Al Sharpton!

Edited by Dman, 12 April 2012 - 02:43 PM.

[tfloangel]

Dman, on 26 March 2012 - 10:14 AM, said:

Hiland is a perfect example. The simple truth is that Hiland does not make Columbus this year, let alone win it, without the transfer. That is the truth without judgement.

Yep, I'm quoting you. You've figured it out. I am quoting what is apparently, the "simple truth without judgment." (correct spelling by the way) Because at this point, I'm choosing to have a sense of humor - or at least really displaying my slightly wicked sense of humor - about the situation.

Dman, on 05 April 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

Tflo:

Hiland does not make it to state, let alone win it without Bonifant. I can't be more direct.

Oh, look! I found another one! Actually I found several, but decided that it would get a bit tedious to link them all (although it would have been entertaining, for flounder and I at least...

tfloangel, on 05 April 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

Ok, fair enough. But I still have a few issues to address, the first of which being that - at least from the Hiland side of things - I AM the only one who is posting in relation to this issue. So while you say its not personal towards me, how else could this not be directed towards me?

Thirdly - You sound like a politician. You make the statement of the third bolded section ALONG with your initial blastings and it makes people aware of the fact that you are in fact willing to consider both sides of an issue from the get go, rather than having to back track and make statements such as "...there is not a coach or informed fan around who would not rather take their chances with a Bonifant...versus building a team the old way" after the fact. They lose credibility at this point.

I am - in fact - allowed to quote back to them anyone's words on this forum. As are you and every other member. It is why - in fact - the function is available on this website I've even done me!!! (Although admittedly the words in bold at the end are still yours...)

NOW, PLEASE READ THIS NEXT PART FOR CAREFULLY, FOR I AM GOING TO SAY 'YOU ARE RIGHT.

Nowhere that I have found on this thread have I ever said that I thought Hiland would win without Seger. All I've said is that I DIDN'T say this. I do believe that I have said on other sites however, that I thought they stood a good chance without him, and that particularly had Luke Burch not been injured, I think that they would have stood a very good chance.

This is why: I have no desire to come across as that kind of an arrogant person.

You know... the one who starts the threads "Why such-and-such team is a lock for state"...in November. Or the fun guy on that - when that other site became free again - started a thread along the lines of "Why "so-and-so" is the best Center ever in the state of Ohio." The entertaining part was that the kid had some kind of ridiculous stat line like 11.2 minutes, 6.7 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 1 bpg. And he was SERIOUS! (And he looked like a total idiot.)

Does this in any stretch mean that I don't think they could have well won without Seger??? I would actually say LAST year more-so than this year, but yes, I absolutely believe that they could have. You would have seen Kaufman and Gingerich averaging about 22 and 17 as opposed to the 17 and 12 that they did, but if you had any inkling of the way the team shared shots and found the hot hand on a given night... I can't believe I'm defending this, but there it is. Would they have been an easier guard as team??? Sure! But I think they also would have been a very strong (as opposed to stifling) defensive team, so sure, they coulda done it.

But that doesn't matter. I didn't ever say it because I figured that as soon as I did, you and any number of people would have either inwardly or outright called me on the arrogant jerk I sounded like. So I didn't do it. Because I don't want to be that kind of person.

Edited by tfloangel, 12 April 2012 - 02:46 PM.

[Dman]

Quote

Oh, look! I found another one!

I'm not sure what your intentions are here. I've conceded to C-town that my quote...

• The simple truth is that Hiland does not make Columbus this year, let alone win it, without the transfer. That is the truth without judgement.

...is/was the weakest part of my argument. I did this quite a few posts back. Credits to C-town for having the courage to say what a lot of informed basketball posters already knew...

But for you to post a point that I've conceded, and act like you've made a great revelation seems like a crappy thing to do. Especially since you apparently are concerned more about what people think of you, than placing your opinions out there to be deciphered.

But you might still be missing a bigger point. I knew that this was a weak argument when I made it. I fully expected it to be challenged...just not on page #14. I wanted to make a bigger point that Hiland's homegrowns were denied an opportunity to prove themselves on their own merit. It fits nicly into the conversation...and had you had the courage to make your point earlier, you could have saved a lot of confusion for both of us.

Moment to note. I've been around these boards a long time. I've got quite a few friends and just as many enemies. I'm not one to mince words in effort to "get along." I also tend to look at subjects from a non-traditional viewpoint and will often post questions/thoughts/opinions to get people to look at a topic from a different direction. For example, right this moment I've got flounder, a self avowed conservative looking at his own positions in a perspective that might pursuade him that he is not nearly conservative as he thinks. It is not about right and wrong. It is about discussing issues. These are called "discussion forums." I'm not always right...I don't strive to be. I just like to debate issues...sometimes from a position I don't quite believe just to see what direction the conversation goes.

Quote

Does this in any stretch mean that I don't think they could have well won without Seger??? I would actually say LAST year more-so than this year, but yes, I absolutely believe that they could have. You would have seen Kaufman and Gingerich averaging about 22 and 17 as opposed to the 17 and 12 that they did, but if you had any inkling of the way the team shared shots and found the hot hand on a given night... I can't believe I'm defending this, but there it is. Would they have been an easier guard as team??? Sure! But I think they also would have been a very strong (as opposed to stifling) defensive team, so sure, they coulda done it.

I respect the crap out of this and wish you would have shared it earlier. I don't have the details of your team like you do...but I've got enough basketball sense to understand that Hiland is a damn good team with or without Segar. I also realize that this years scores with Segar are not indicitive of what they could/would have been had he not been there. Your kids and coaching staff would have found a way to be competative. Would it have been enough...?

Quote

But that doesn't matter. I didn't ever say it because I figured that as soon as I did, you and any number of people would have either inwardly or outright called me on the arrogant jerk I sounded like.

There is nothing arrogant about the truth. The only people that would have thought you arrogant for dropping the truth on us are idiots anyhow. And who cares what they think? The way I see it, if you are not pissing some people off, you are playing it way too safe. We have enough boring entertainment options to water down message forums too. One of the great advantages of a nameless place like this is that it drops the sensitivities and allows arguments to stand or fail on their merits. This is not personal. I honestly don't care who you are. This is the reason I did not even realize you were a girl. I made the same mistakes with slice many years ago. I personally wish there were just "arguments" without screen names. I've often thought the first person to start a message forum like that....wins! It is the personal BS that tends to clutter up the discussion. People start worrying more about the screen name than the discussion.

Look I'll say it for the umpteenth time...I don't see an area where we disagree except for your opinion that transfer based teams deserve equal credit to those that do it traditionally. So what? What do you care if some internet fan from Delphos thinks your wrong on that issue? Especially when there are about 10 other issues he agrees with you about?

If you still have the urge to attack, I dare opine that you've taken this way too personally. This makes no sense since a message board is the one place designed to alleviate all the personal BS!

...look at flounder and I this moment! We disagree on this issue ALL THE TIME! He is also one of my favorite, if not most favorite posters on here.

[flounder]

Dman, on 12 April 2012 - 04:08 PM, said:

...look at flounder and I this moment! We disagree on this issue ALL THE TIME! He is also one of my favorite, if not most favorite posters on here.

Dman....

Thank you for that compliment...I certainly appreciate it as I enjoy discussing things with you on many different topics....your posts...although sometimes...wait a minute, I must clarify that statement.....most of the time, are a bit long winded, but I can live with that......just a bit of humor there Dman......and yes, I am a conservative.....but, I really can see where tflo is coming from.......actually, tflo and I met on the Huddle many years ago.....yes, she is a female and I was totally surprised when I found that out, but I must also add that she is one very well informed female who I respect and feel very comfortable discussing different sports issues with...... I have always enjoyed her informative posts....and actually, she has a great sense of humor......man, was I ever surprised when I found out that tflo was the person of a different username on the Huddle.....I couldn't believe some of the things I said to her, but she handled it very well......and I have been really impressed how she has been so loyal to Berlin Hiland....but, I would not expect anything but that from her.....and that is why I see her point as being very valid..........Berlin Hiland was a very talented group the past 2 seasons.....I know they had a close game in the regionals, but many state champions do have a hiccup on their way to the title.....whether Bonifat plays or not, I think Berlin was the odds on favorite to win the state championship.........there are way to many variables to factor in when considering who is going to bring home the trophy, so I feel Hiland was the odds on favorite.......what is taking place in high school sports is inevitable....we are not going to change it, so we must adapt to it and live with it.......

From what I can gather Dman from your past posts, I think you feel that transfers tarnish a state championship.......you know, maybe so, but I can remember one state championship that my school DSJ won with a transfer......it happened on the girls basketball team, and I am being honest in this assessment................not many people even remember, and the girls on that team do not look at it that way.......according to OHSAA, they are state champions in Ohio, and that is what really matters to them......why pi$$ on their parade and accomplishments........I am not saying it is right, but it is becoming commonplace in many schools throughout our state....again, I am not condoning it.....and I think tflo feels as I do......

You know Dman, I could go on and on concerning this topic, but what I really think is that tflo, myself, and you are all in more agreement than you think!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Hillstone]

So what does all this have to do with Vanlue?